Posts by Max Divergent

69

The 1995 Generation Change

by sloppyjoe2 in

jw
friends

i was just a teenager and have a vivid memory of sitting in a chair doing a microphone for the sunday meeting.

everyone was commenting that it didn't mean the end was far off, and it didn't change the condition of the dead, or the 144,000, or the trinity so we should still remain faithful.

this is my first memory as a kid being just a teen that i ever had a single doubt.

Max Divergent

At about that time I asked myself if I'd stay a JW even if it could be proved wrong. I thought I might.

When the article came up, I was surprised the lack of response to it. The article made no sense, but it washed away a huge chunk of chronology. I brushed that off, but I probably also stopped bothering to care if the teachings were true or not too as a result. It didn't matter, since every teaching was evidently able to be made to go away with just one article that would just be accepted. What would be next?

I'd thought before about what I'd do if the religion was proved false, and I suppose I hadn't been able to comprehend being the first in my family to leave the JWs at tbat time. It took 2 more years to sort myself out and realize that I would not, could not stay and it was ok to leave.

So I left. The Watchtower is just a weekly science fiction series.

17

Statement in today's WT

by stillin in

paragraph 14.

"the majority if unmarried youths who lose their virginity say that they regret what they did.".

where do they get this stuff?.

Max Divergent

"The majority if unmarried youths who lose their virginity say that they regret what they did and promise to keep on practising over and over, every day that they can until they get it right"

or

"The majority if unmarried youths who lose their virginity say that they regret what they did and that they are looking for someone better looking and more experienced for next time'

or

"The majority if unmarried youths who lose their virginity say that they regret what they did and that they'll remember to pay a visit to the drug store first next time"

or

"The majority if unmarried youths who lose their virginity say that they regret what they did: they now realise they should never have turned up for those bible studies, meetings or their baptism that resulted in them taking so long to experience the joys of sex and to feel so worried and guilty about it"

or

"The majority if unmarried youths who lose their virginity say that they regret what they did that got them caught by the elders"

17

Conversation with ultra dub relative. Pure quality this one

by joe134cd in

if any one has been taking note of my posts, it could be said that i often mention conversations i have had with dubbies.

in some ways not been dfed has allowed me to gain some real in sight into how they think and their justification for things.

the following is a conversation i just had with an ultra super dub relative, and to be honest i don't know weather i should be laughing or crying over it.. relative: the rc this year is going to be held in the assembly hall.

Max Divergent

Well, he has a point since in the end 'the love of the greater number will cool off'.

So if they're closer, they'll be warmer.

35

Are JWs trying to make dysfunctional kids and destroy their ability to live normal lives?

by C0ntr013r in

are jws trying to make dysfunctional kids that wont "fit" in normal society so they will "return to jehovah"?

because there have been many stories about young people who have been out in the world only to find how bad it was and how correct the org was.. a good jw kid with "good" jw parents will have many big issues, some examples:.

fear of demons (fear, misfit).

Max Divergent

Brilliant post.

That is what they do. By design or not.

Most JW / XJW are screwed up one way or another. And the irony is that 'the world' is much more helpful, accepting and safe than the 'Spiritual Paradise' for those who try to overcome the bad start the JWs get.

Go to the brothers for judgment, but to your choice of therapist / whatever for recovery, growth and a fairer crack at life.

14

What Jehovah can't do...

by C0ntr013r in

during the rc today i heard this(i am paraphrasing and translating):.

"jehovah has created the physical universe for us.

he is a spirit and he can't enjoy physical things so he created it for us alone.

Max Divergent

Jehovah has the same limitations and capabilities as the WB&T Society, GB and the Writing Department because they, together, are Jehovah.

20

Is it necessary to prepare for the Watchtower or book study?

by BashfulAshG in

all of my years in the truth, i never understood why we had to study before each meeting.

the contents are self-explanatory with the answers to the printed question within the first or the last sentence of the paragraph.

then, commenting never made sense, especially comments and experiences that don't answer the printed question.

Max Divergent

I couldn't bear to pre-study, hated it. But I was quite a regular fill-in Watchtower and book study conductor or reader: so, typically, I was up there having not much idea what was in the article / book, but I'd heard it all before so could usually guess the gist.

But I soon realised it didn't matter a damn whether the conductor knew if the answers were right or not, or even what the subject was. I just had to be nice to them all from the platform, utter some clichés, and get about three answers per paragraph, but avoid numpties who'd could be predicted to say something I'd be expected to recognise as wrong (but probably wouldn't coz I wasn't really listening).

Everything just seemed to take care of itself. I quite liked conducting / reading the studies since it relieved the boredom of sitting though one.

The only thing was that it was embarrassing not to have a marked Watchtower. Sometimes I didn't care, sometimes I did something cursory. Toward the end I just ran random highlighter pen over the page for appearances sake.

50

How do Americans feel about Canadians and Britons interjecting their opinions onto hot localized political topics: gun laws, abortion, ect?

by adjusted knowledge in

jw
friends

in addition to the above question, why do citizens of the two above mentioned countries, or other countries, feel the necessity to tell americans how they should interpret the american constitution for localized issues?.

i fairly much have an idea what the general population in the usa feels in regards to the first question.

this could be one of the possible reasons cnn piers morgan poor ratings and eventual firing.

Max Divergent

Hi TD

I get the difference between holding an opinion and expressing an opinion.

I hold, however, that it's a bit redundant to question people's expressed opinions on an internet discussion forum on the basis of the country they're from.

By all means fire away on the basis of the expressed opinion being rooted in ignorance of the complexities of the issues or whatever other objective failure there may be in whatever someone might write.

But to say a Brit or a Canadian or whatever should have nothing to say about X because X is only for Americans to discuss is a bit rude. A foreigner may have as much of value to say as an American.

Or not.

I just say consider the value of the contribution made to the discussion, not the national origin of the poster.

24

A brazen falsehood in this week's Watchtower study! (week of Feb 9 - 15, 2015)

by Island Man in

on page 13 of the december 15, 2014 watchtower (study edition), the first 2 sentences of paragraph 10 say:.

"the symbolic separating of fish does not refer to the final judgment during the great tribulation.

rather, it highlights what would happen during the last days of this wicked system.".

Max Divergent

I just can't even make much sense of what they write now. They just string together a bunch of assertions in metaphorical language. It's so lightweight it doesn't make sense.

11

BRITAIN | Man 'glassed in the face' at Kingdom Hall of Jehovah's Witnesses

by jwleaks in

jw
friends

news report.

13 february 2015 .

man 'glassed in the face' at kingdom hall of jehovah's witnesses.

Max Divergent

That is truly awful. All thoughts with the victim and their family and friends, let's hope the injuries heal well and the attacker gets the help he needs: like secure accommodation.

72

Does anyone remember a district overseer Joe Slaiman?

by stuckinarut2 in

jw
friends

joe slaiman and his wife jean were in the travelling work in australia throughout the 90's... ( i may have spelt the name incorrectly).

anyone remember them?

they were very well liked by many of the brothers and sisters.. i wonder what happened to him?

Max Divergent

I found an old post of mine on the same topic, written much closer to the time with more details and, no doubt, more accurate than my memory is now of the conversation. Maybe they asked multiple similar questions.

The point, though, is about whether the focus at the time of departure from the Witnesses is on belief in God and the bible, or acceptance of the organisation.

For context, I was a third generation JW, a well-liked goody-two-shoes, self-righteous prick and good public speaker who had recently stepped down as an uber-MS and stopped going to meetings. The DO had recently left (that was Joe) and two COs had recently been DF'd while on our circuit.

For what it's worth, this is a lightly edited excerpt from 13 years ago:

The question they asked me was something like: 'In your opinion, do the Witnesses present the truth, but that truth isn't for you; or, do you believe the Witnesses do not present the truth'? I replied that I'd given that some thought and checked the dictionary definition for heresy and that seemed to describe the first condition they described. I'd also checked the dictionary definition for apostasy, and that seemed to describe the second condition.

I said that I didn't think that either condition described my position, but that I was acutely aware that my current thoughts were probably wrong and that I couldn't and wouldn't presume to trouble others with it. 'At the end of the day, I'm not sure where I'm at in regard those very serious positions you describe, but I remain absolutely dedicated to truth and goodness. I just don't know about those sorts of really big questions at the moment' (and what's wrong with any of that from the JW point of view?).

I wasn't subject of any judicial process at all. The point is that you can leave without being DF/DA, if you no do not profess a position against the Society. Private non-belief or un-certainty are fine. I used to assist in the shepherding of 'inactive ones' (ie: those who'd left on their own terms and weren't DF/DA), some I had met on the doors and had no idea had been JWs.

The attitude of the elders seemed fourfold:

1) calling was a duty,

2) it was just a matter of being nice and letting them know they could come back,

3) it didn't matter what sins they were committing (de facto relationships, smoking etc), and

4) it was easy field service hours, often complete with tea and cake, so long as they weren't identifying as JWs.